Monday, December 1, 2008
Colossians Chapter 2
To keep the discussions flowing, I'll start this new post on Chapter 2 of Colossians. The chapter 1 discussion is still on going and feel free to keep adding to it. I don't think we've tapped out all it's truths yet. But I can already tell that chapter 2 has much to discuss and I'm looking forward to getting into it. Hopefully everyone involved can see that a close study of the scriptures opens up many thoughts, studies, and discussions. That's my intent and I appreciate all who are actively involved as well as those who are quietly following along. But to those quiet ones, I want to encourage you to contribute to the discussion. Just searching for something to write in these forums often times opens up your mind to new and challenging thoughts. Give it a try!
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I've been tied up this week with getting a Sunday School lesson ready for this Sunday. So I haven't been into Colossians the way I need to in order to post a comment about it. But I will share a little about what I'm planning on teaching on this week. The scripture verses are in Isaiah and have a modern day application that relates to Racism. That's a fun topic to discuss in a Christian church. It's estimated that 95% of churches in America are still segregated. I think we missed the mark somewhere! Here is a quote from MLK Jr. back in 1963, and unfortunately I'd bet he would be saying it still today:
“we must face the fact that in America, the church is still the most segregated major institution in America. At 11:00 on Sunday morning when we stand and sing that Christ has no east or west, we stand at the most segregated hour in this nation.”
If there are members of the church who actually believe the Bible teaches reacism, what can one or two people do in a church already established to get other races involved? How can we do it in a manner that makes everyone comfortable? The church should be a safe haven for everyone, no matter what race or ethnicity. It should also be a safe haven for believers and nonbelievers too. If we don't welcome nonbelievers and people who don't believe feel judged or criticized, then are we doing our part? Are we loving? Just rambling here ...
"For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form" (Col 2:9)
How do you see Jesus? Do you see Him as a good hearted man and a great teacher? Do you see Him as a make believe character? Do you see Him as a liar and a fool? Or do you see Him as God in a human body?...because I think these are the only four options.
If you see Jesus ONLY as a good man and a great teacher then you are obviously wrong because a good man and great teacher would not lie about being God. So Jesus could be a liar and a fool, or He could be God. Or the other option is He could be make believe. But you would be hard pressed to convince anyone that His impact on this world and all it's societies is a product of a good fiction story.
So the two main choices are, was Jesus God or not? Here in Colossians we have Paul stating that Jesus is "ALL THE FULLNESS OF GOD IN BODILY FORM". And this is written by a man who, before his encounter with Christ, was determined to wipe out Christianity by means of torcher and murder. Talk about a change of heart.
These word of Paul in Collosians are echoed in one of my favorite Christmas songs...can you name it?
"Fall on your knees, oh hear the angel voices. Oh night divine, Oh night when Christ was born"
definition of DEVINE: Having the nature of or being a deity (GOD).
I haven't had much time lately to study but I want to reflect on what Greg put in his last blog about Jesus and also our Sunday School lesson on Sunday.
I've really been doing a lot of thinking this week about how "Blessed" we are to live in this country.
Here, we have been born Gentiles and the Bible teaches that his chosen people's (Jews) eyes were blinded to the truth of Jesus so that the gentiles could be grafted in and if, I remember correctly, to make His chosen envious that the gentile would know Him. We have been offered so many opportunities to know the truth. A church on every corner, TV programs teaching the word. Friends and relatives who can witness but "Yet" there are so many who still reject him. There are times that I feel I reject His ways and live in disobedience and flesh. Doing only what I want and what I feel like.
But, then you look at the verse in John 3:16 “For God so loved the WORLD that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in Him Shall Be Saved”. Look at that, the WORLD. Not just here, but in every Nation. In our lesson Sunday we talked about how a person born into a family that does not know Jesus, the Bible, the truth but yet, he will die in his sin. Man, what a hard truth that is.
I realize that only the Holy Spirit is the one to draw a person to Jesus but they also need to be taught the Word. In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
So, once again let me say, “How Truly Blessed we are to be Born in a Nation that has every opportunity to know that Jesus is fully God and fully man. How Blessed I am that the Holy Spirit drew me. How Blessed I am that I have a Bible and can read it at any time. WOW, that’s some responsibility that has been placed on me (us). Where much has been given much is required. But, we are responsible to plant the seed only and it’s up to the Holy Spirit to do the rest but the Holy Spirit is also a gentleman and will not break anyone’s WILL.
I hope this did not come across negative, it’s just weighing heavy on me all of a sudden.
Vs. 2 of Colossians chapter 2 has the phrase "in order that they may know the mystery of God". There's an oxymoron...to KNOW the MYSTERY. But I'm glad that Paul uses the word mystery to describe God. All too often, we Christians claim to have God all figured out. But God's ways are not our ways (name that verse) and there is a certain comfort in just saying "I don't know.".
What will the End of Times be like?...I DON'T KNOW.
If alcohol consumption is considered a sin, why did Jesus turn water into wine?...I DON"T KNOW.
What happens to people who never get to hear about Jesus?...I DON'T KNOW.
How old does a child need to be to truly trust in Jesus?...I DON"T KNOW?
If my salvation is secure in Christ then why am I called to "persevere", "hold fast", and "work out my own salvation"?...I DON'T KNOW.
God and His ways are often a mystery to us, but scripture is also clear on some key issues: God does not lie. God is love. God works all things out for the good of those who love Him. Jesus Christ paid our price on the cross. Etc...
So I for one am not afraid to say "I don't Know" to some questions about God. And this verse in Colossians reassures me that I'm not alone.
I know some of you out there may want to answer some of the questions above...if so, feel free.
Since we're in Colossians I had to put this out here.
http://www.thephilfiles.com:80/2008/10/21/is-it-in-you/
It's worth your time to go in and watch.
Take a look at Luke 2 with me. I ran across this concept as I was reading this week on the subject of Jesus being God (the Incarnation: God chosing to be born into human form but being totally Divine/God at the same time). Think a little about different creations prespective of God and Jesus during the moment of the birth of the Christ child. Angels were present at the moment of Incarnation. They said something that night that should causes goosebumps to jump onto my neck and arms. In verse 14, the angels give us the first Christmas carol that was ever made.
As a total side note, angels in the Bible do not sing all the time,
they speak most of the time. Only one time in all of the
Bible do angels sing and that was in the book of Job. I believe 37 or 38, where they sing praise to God as He beings to create things out of nothing but the power of His Word. God spoke things into existence. Awesome!!
The angels said "Glory to God in the highest...." Selah...think about that. These angels werer the same angles that existed when creation was in the mind of God but hadn't become a reality yet. As Job describes for us, they shouted and sang praise as God created. As God created the heavens and the earth, they sang an octive of praise to God saying, "Glory to God". As God created Light and seperated it from the darkness, they sang a new octive of praise to our God saying, "Glory to God". As God created land and earth and animals, they sang higher octives of praise, "Glory to God!"
Then, at the 6th day, the apex of God creation dawned and God created man in his image. Angels had never seen anything like this, and since it was created in God's image, it was uniquely special. Man was breathed into and was made a living soul. Still the angels reached higher with a new octive, "Glory to God." Yet, there was a note of praise that they had not reached. God saved for them a new note for a special occasion. Higher notes they thought they couldn't reach than at the creation of Adam, yet God gave them another note that could reach higher than any note they had sang/shouted throughout their existence. At the incarnation of our Savior, when they seen our Christ come to us, we who deserve nothing and aren't worthy of the least of God blessings, when they seen the miracle of their God transforming Himself into a human being while maintaining His presence in eternity, they shouted a new note of praise. "Glory to God.... in the highest!!!" Higher praise they could not give. Glory to God in the highest!!!!!!! A new octive the angels were given which sounded through the corridors of heaven and earth. Their harmony can still be heard. Hallelujah!! " Glory to God in the highest..."
God, give us a glimpse of what those angels saw that lowly night.
Do you think that the "mystery of God" in Col.2:2 is a direct reference back to Col.1:24-27? Check it out with me. There is something there about Paul's connection with a group of people that may be extremely significant.
You all feel free to post a comment about what you think about these verses.
I am loving this study. As I was thinking about the mysteries and the glory of God, I found myself getting up during the night to read the scripture that Johnny had mentioned. As we study this and go deeper into this take a look at 1 Cor. 2: 1-16.
We have access to the Holy Place --we need to get out of the way, lay our own heart down. Instead of striving, we need to move aside and let God be God in us.
I want to add one more thing. During my study this morning, I came to Matthew 11. Before we continue with this study, I would like to add to those who may not know Jesus yet to read Matthew 11: 25 - 30.
Jesus is thanking his/our heavenly Father for hidding these things from the wise and purdent and revealing them to babes. Jesus is saying that all things are given to him by the Father and no man knoweth Jesus except the Father and no man knoweth the Father except the son and ALSO, THOSE TO WHOM HE(Jesus) REVEALS THE FATHER TO.
So, he's extending an invitation here in Matthew 11:28: Jesus says, "Come to me all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest". Jesus says, "Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. For Jesus says, "My yoke is easy, and my burden is light".
This rest is an inward rest, the yoke is guided by a stronger partner, he's someone who will meet our needs, he gives us manageable load that fits who we are.
I was wondering today in the morning service...Pastor Guy Roberts was talking about the Incarnation being majestic and mysterious. He took us to a text in I Tim.3:15-16. "...the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth. And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, recieved up into glory." The phrase that stuck out was "the mystery of godliness"... Now, over in the Colossians 2:2 there is a mystery called "the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ". Do you think there is a difference in "the mystery of godliness" in I Tim. 3.:15-16 and "the mystery of God" in Col.2:2?
If you will allow I would like to give an opinion. There is comfort in saying I don’t know but what if we really do know but the answers are not always comforting?
First - Matthew 25 and Daniel and Revelation tells us what the end times will be like, , a falling away, plagues, diseases and many, many other hard things. That is why we must study and increase our faith so we can hold on to JESUS and ride out the storm.
Second - Drunkenness is a sin, it is even “implied” to be a lifestyle. I could elaborate how the drunkard will not make it into heaven but I have family that struggles with this and it is hard for me to ponder those words. In the Passover celebrated by the Jewish people (which is what JESUS is) Jesus tells us in the book of Luke that when he picked up the third cup of wine (which is the cup of praise) HE will not partake until we partake together in Heaven. Instead HE instituted what we call communion. My opinion is following JESUS’ example.
Third - Our GOD is supremely holy. I believe with all my heart HE makes HIMSELF known to all before they depart this world. They have a choice. The sad part is I know it must break GOD’s heart to watch multitudes of people marching into hell, HIS precious creation using the gift HE gave them; FREE WILL to their detriment.
Fourth - a child who can make a decision as to how they want to live their life is accountable. The age will vary depending on the child. “Raise them up in the way they should go and they will not depart from it”
Fifth – how I see this is salvation is a lifestyle not a proclamation. We read in the book of Matthew “In that day some will cry LORD LORD but I shall say depart from me you worker of iniquity for I never know you.” (Notice this does not say sinner) for all have sinned and fall short, but REAL lovers of the LORD live it. We try and yes fail (me quite frequently) but we dust off our sandals and continue.
Now how about knowing everything about GOD?? NO!!! I DON’T KNOW! But now isn’t that the most wonderful thing about the Christian life those ah ha moments when GOD shows you something new!! HE has given us an instruction book to know who HE is and where HE has been. The time we spend talking to HIM and listening to HIM will show us where HE is and where HE is going if we just take the time to listen and watch. The journey is wonderful, not easy but wonderful. Where would I be without HIM?
Mysteries of GOD
I can tell you of a mystery revealed to me. My father passed away three weeks ago Friday. Before he left this earth he cracked open the door of heaven for me. He described all he saw taking place around him. (He was given no pain releivers because he had no pain). He saw brightness he held his arms up and said "yes LORD JESUS I am ready when you are" He said he could not see JESUS yet, but he saw people. Happy people and his brother waved to him and my father waved back and patted my hand and said it is too wonderful to describe. He saw colors that were so magnificient he was unable to describe them. He longed to lay flat because the brightness was all around and he couldn't see. (he had phemonia so couldn't be laid back). The people were so happy to see him and I asked why were they there he said "they are waiting". There was also a man in the room. not old not young and dad said he was very beautiful. I asked if he was an angel, dad studied him for a moment and said "I can't tell". The man was with my father in the Myrtle Beach hospital, in the airplane ride back to Greenville in the ambulance, and in his room at St Francis Hospital. He never left him.
GOD is so good. Everything we have waiting for us is a mystery but according to my father just looking in it is wonderful, beautiful, spectacular, colors that his eyes never saw before. My father was leaving us and heading to a place my heart now longs for I know he never looked back. He said over and over again don't be afraid of this don't ever be afraid. And since one of GOD's days is a thousand of our years he's only been there a second and has not even experienced all the mysteries of GOD.
I don't understand why a Holy GOD would look on us sinners so favorably. Frist HE gave HIS SON to shed HIS blood for us, HIS SON took the sting from death and the grave can no longer hold us. THE CLINCHER IS HE LETS US TASTE HEAVEN SO WE CAN LET GO AND COME TO HIM!!!! Why? I am so blessed. My heart is broken at the same time the blessing of GOD over joy me.
I was pretty sure the five questions I asked and answered with "I don't know" had the potential to generate some discussions. I was sure of that because as I was typing them I wanted to state my opinion of each. But as Gina stated in her comment, it would just be an opinion. Each question has it's own role in causing division in the Christian community. To have an opinion on any of those five questions is to stand on one side of an issue where another Christian is sure to be standing on the other side. Which is why we end up having so many different denominations. The Presbyterians, Baptist, Catholics, Lutherans, Methodist, Episcopalians, and the Charismatics all share in the faith of Jesus, but differ greatly on some key issues ...like the five different questions I posted.
Premillinialist debate postmillinialist on the translation of Revelations and Daniel. The End Times will definitely be nasty, but will Christ's church have to endure this struggle or will we be rapture?
There's no debating the destructive nature of alcohol, but while drunkenness is condemned in the Bible, the presents of alcohol is found in many scripture references and never condemned by Jesus or His disciples. So this creates another debatable and often decisive issue.
The age of accountability and man's ability to hear, accept, and continue in the gospel of Christ finds it's never ending debate in the Calvinist vs. Armenian (predestination vs. man's free will) argument that has been going on for at least 500 years.
These key, or maybe not so key issues are often decisive and destructive to Christ's church. I don't think this means they should be avoided, but often the answers to the debated questions can be found in the undebateable questions. For example, ask any one of the five questions and answer it with Romans 8:28 and see how that sounds.
Thanks Gina for your input and the love you have for Jesus, and I'm sorry to here about your father's passing, but it sounds like you can also testify to the truth in Romans 8:28. Please keep your comments coming! And thanks to both Johnny and Revonda for their steady contribution to this discussion. Hopefully tomorrow I'll be able to look deeper into your scripture references.
The spirit of legalism and the spirit of religion are very pervasive in our society. When we begin to make a stand for “opinion” we loose sight of what we are suppose to be, followers of CHRIST. Colossians chapter 2 is telling us to forget philosophy just concentrate on JESUS. Forget legalism concentrate on JESUS. As Christians with varying opinions we should listen to other opinions and pray for truth, and only be swayed by JESUS. He is the beginning and the end. End times are very different than the tribulation. Will we leave in the beginning middle or end? Colossians is trying to tell us it doesn’t really matter as long as you are holding tight to JESUS. No matter what the future holds, it’s all about GOD the FATHER, GOD the SON, and GOD the HOLY SPIRIT.
If I may I would like to introduce you to another difference we have in the Christian church, God trackers and GOD chasers.
God trackers - Many people search GODs' word to find where HE has been. They are content to study and learn, as with a magnifying glass studying HIS tracks.
GOD chasers are those who hearts chase hard after the LORD, they want HIS presence.
Some people are afraid of GOD they are contented to listen to others tell them of GOD or read and study but not pray and seek or open their heart and mind to the realization HE IS ALIVE and wants to have supreme authority in their life. We are not so different from the Israelites:
Exodus 20:18 Now all the people witnessed the thunderings, the lightning flashes, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking; and when the people saw it, they trembled and stood afar off. 19 Then they said to Moses, “You speak with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us, lest we die.”
20 And Moses said to the people, “Do not fear; for God has come to test you, and that His fear may be before you, so that you may not sin.” 21 So the people stood afar off, but Moses drew near the thick darkness where God was. (Moses was a GOD chaser as was David, Isaiah,Daniel, Jeremiah and many more.)
Intimacy with GOD is only prayer away. May we chase hard after GOD.
Matthew 7:7 “Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 8 For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.Jeremiah 29:13 And you will seek Me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart. Deuteronomy 4:29 But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you seek Him with all your heart and with all your soul.
1 Chronicles 28:9“As for you, my son Solomon, know the God of your father, and serve Him with a loyal heart and with a willing mind; for the LORD searches all hearts and understands all the intent of the thoughts. If you seek Him, He will be found by you; but if you forsake Him, He will cast you off forever.
It is not possible to develop a relationship with someone you never talk to.
"having been buried with him in baptism and raised with him through your faith in the power of God" (Col. 2:12)
This must be the verse, or one of the verses, that explains why people don't believe in infant Baptism. Here Paul seems to be stating that Baptism is a symbol of being "buried and raised" just as Christ was buried and raised, IE..born again.
It's interesting how Paul is talking about "circumcision" in the verses before he talks about baptism. Is Baptism a symbol of circumcision too? Both are a done by "the hands of men" (vs. 11) to signify something being done by God (initiation a relationship).
I like verse 13. It says "when you were dead in your sins, God made you alive". KJV says "hath he quickened together with him". This verse kinda takes away any opportunity for personal boasting about my relationship with God. He "MADE me alive"! Eph 2:4-6 duplicates this statement, but even adds more to it:
"But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:" (Eph 2:4-6 KJV)
Check out the end of that scripture.."He MADE us sit together.."
Sometimes I feel like a puppet! What I mean by that is if you would have asked me who I was going to be as a 38 year-old man, I wouldn't have said "A Christian". But that is how I identify myself now, and hopefully how others identify me as well. And verses like these help me to realize that who I am isn't who I wanted to be, but rather who God wanted me to be. And I must say, I wouldn't want it any other way!
please elaborate:
"This verse kinda takes away any opportunity for personal boasting about my relationship with God.
"He "MADE me alive"!
I DON'T UNDERSTAND, WHAT DOES THIS MEAN????????
"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast" (Eph 2:8-9)
Paul has almost the same thought process in Ephesians chapter 2 (vs 1-10) as he does in Colossians chapter 2 (vs 9-14). "God saves the dead in their sinful state" (Col.), and "by grace you have been saved" (Eph).
To God be all the glory...not me!
what a wonderful, beautiful gift.
We cannot move on with this discussion of Col.2 without seeing the depth in vs.10. Man, someone help me out with this one now.
"And ye are completed in him, which is the head of all principality and power." "And ye ARE complete in Him". That's present tense. Right now I am more complete, as a person, than I have ever been. It didn't take money, it didn't take children, it didn't take a spouse, it didn't take a house, it didn't take a church, it took Christ to make me complete. It was Christ alone- plus nothing, minus nothing, just Christ. C'mon someone give me something deep on that text!!!!
Jesus has been raised from the dead, he's seated at the right hand of God in the heavenly places. His name is above all principality and power and might and dominion.
It's a "divine" government.
Jesus - His name is above all names - all sickness - cancer for example. Glory to God! So when we pray for someone to be healed of cancer we can know that Jesus name is above that name and he's our healer.
Principality - "order of angels". He is over powers of every kind. When we acknowledge Christ as our Lord, it changes OUR STATUS!!!!
David L. is still actively studying chapter 1. He just posted a new comment on the first Colossians' post that should generate some thought...and discussion. Check it out.
And Johnny's comment kinda reads like a Dr. Seuss' book:
"it didn't take a spouse, it didn't take a house"
But how correct you are in the depth of that verse. Yesterday as I was re-reading the chapter, I was in awe at it's depth through-out. Each line is packed with so mush power and truth that I went into "system over-load".
This format of blogging is kinda like a personal Bible commentary by each participant. And as I was searching for a comment to add to Paul's writing, I realized Paul's words are so perfect that the only beneficial thing I could do would be to copy them word for word. Colossians chapter 2 is so deep but so elementary at the same time. It's almost like Paul had help from the Holy Spirit while writing this letter! (I'm winking now).
Johnny, I can't stop laughing. Greg's so right...You couched such profundity in a Dr. Seuss rhyme. You're my hero.
OK everybody, I sure don't have any answers but after reading Teresa's comments under Col. 2, I have a lot of questions.
So, if Paul saw the "Glory" of God in a way that the church has never seen before, then what's it going to take?
If our walk/journey is a process and we've all been given a measure of FAITH -- then are we going to be given a measure of "Glory"?
How do we go from "glory to glory"? Is it all about dying to self?
It seems to me that the church is afraid of being in the presence of God or maybe we don't know how to get there...
Man, we can't even seem to grasp AGAPE love, which can only come from the Holy Spirit.
Is this glory what we're all searching for?
I heard a message at lunch today on the radio. The couple were discussing the Trinity. They said the church can seem to get a hold of God, we can even understand Jesus, but...the Holy Spirit is a "MYSTERY" to the church. Made me think about our study about the Mystery of God. Isn't He......are we prepared to get out of our box and expect the unexpected? Anybody?????
To put you all at ease, my rhyme in the last post was totally, 100%, absolutely, couldn't be any more, straight off the cuff, meant to be that way. I can't believe you guys are so jealous, but I should expect it; it comes with this level of skill. Don't be hatin' on a brother!!
David L. I have an answer to your text but I don't have the time to get into tonight. I'll try to write tommorrow.
"The glory of God is man fully alive." -St. Irenaeus
Bible study is tricky! Look at the difference in the meaning in these two translations of the same verse:
"And not holding the Head..." (Col. 2:19 KJV)
"He has lost connection with the Head.." (Col. 2:19 NIV)
The "Head" obviously being Christ, the Head of the Christain Church. But to "not hold" and to "lose connection" can be completely different. To lose connection implies that connection was made at one time. So the NIV is implying a connection to Christ can be lost or broken. But the KJV seems to imply that there was never a connection made. So what seems like a minor detail is actually a major theological contradiction.
I don't say this to open up the discussion of "how permanent is our bond to Jesus?", but rather to just show that it's wise to look at many different translations of the Bible to best determine God's truth. And how do we know which translation is best expressing God's truth?...Just get to know God and then you'll just know!
We are given a measure of faith when we are born again, but our faith is to grow as we grow spiritually. Basically faith is "knowing" God intimately. In Col. 2:3 Paul said "In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge." There is no mystery in salvation, life in the spirit realm only begins there. It's when we begin to hunger and thirst after righteousness that we press in, and like John the beloved disciple laid his head upon the breast of Jesus and heard His heart beat that the mystery is unraveled. In Him it is hidden. That's the "glory." The glory is not a thing; it's a person - Jesus.
John was the only disciple Jesus trusted enough to tell the secrets of His heart.We don't easily tell our secrets to just anybody, well, God don't either. He even told John who would betray Him. He didn't tell the others. The secret of the Lord are with them that fear Him. We can't get the heart of God (His secrets)
without being intimate with Him. Intimacy is a must to see the glory. We need it to reach others. Wisdon + Knowledge = Good judgement. Not many have it (sound spiritual judgement) today, but we will, if we press in.
Impressive comment! I especially like "The glory is not a thing; it's a person - Jesus." And although it's not your everyday Christian teaching, I see the truth in it. As hard as it is to admit, Jesus did apparently have disciples He was closer to. (John and Peter) Was this by Jesus' choice or the disciples?..I'll agree with "anonymous'" comment and put that responsibility on the believer. ("It's when we begin to hunger and thirst after righteousness that we press in"). Very good stuff!
Many are called, but few are chosen. Peter and John were Jesus' chosen, because they chose to be intimate with Him. Thses are the sheep that will follow the Lamb where ever He goes. We must become laid down lovers - yeilded lovers of God. Eph. 5:21-26 there is the comparison of the Church to a marriage(vs26). Ever wonder why he made that comparison? Marriage is a covenant of love and committment, and the fruit of our union (marriage and committment) is our children. The fruit of our union with Christ should be that we become mature sons with uncommon knowledge (knowledge gained in the secret place of His presence). We should be sons and daughters mature enough to carry out the Master's business in the earth. We should be bringing the kingdom of God into the earth. We are representatives of the Kingdom of God in the earth. God will make you His favorite if you make Him your favorite.
Whole heartedly agree with "anonymous." Would post further concerning intimacy with God but I've gotta get to work!
Anonymous: Just in case you're not interested in being the "unknown theologian," if you click on "Name/URL" you can type in your name. Greg just showed me that. I was using "anonymous" as a default. Hope this helps.
Thanks David; I'm stirred to hear you guys discuss the word. I think it's great. Thanks for allowing me to comment. I tend to see things much different, and sometimes it may cause some minds to go tilt.
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.(Matt. 5:17-18)The words of Jesus
Then Paul writes:
"...having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us....he took it away, nailing it to the cross." (Col. 2:14)
Do these two verses contradict each other? Does the Law of the Old Testament apply to people today who place their faith in Jesus?
Jesus said the Law will remain intact until "EVERYTHING is accomplished", even until "heaven and earth disappear".
But Jesus also says the He came to "Fulfill the Law". And Jesus did come to earth, and has already left the earth (at least physically)...so we can assume He has already fulfilled the Law of the Old Testament. So why does He want it to remain intact? What do we gain from having the Law's written code, even though it is now cancelled?
There's some food for thought for your Christmas holidays!
I hope everyone has a merry Christmas! and...
"COME LET US ADORE HIM Christ the Lord"
I've been studying the mysteries of God in Col. and also John Paul Jackson has been teaching on the mysteries of God. Thought the timing was perfect. So this is what I've gotten so far.
When we accept Jesus into our heart the light of the Holy Spirit comes into us. God starts to take the wild, earthly nature and starts subduing it. It is a slow process but the dying to self to get to everlasting life can be painful.
The first tabernacle in the old testament represented God and was designed by God and meant for man to draw close and worhship Him. It was designed to remove the sin of separation and to help man Know God - "Deeply Know God".
The sanctuary was for those who have made it into His presence with Him. This is where He talked to Moses Face to Face.
Today the Tabernacle is the bosom of the Father. (John 1:18 - No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.) We learn to enter into Him and then we learn to let Him enter into us. Jesus came from the bosom of the Father and said He would send His Spirit which also came from the Father's bosom. In Revelation 4 is a description of the Father sitting on His throne. John describes God as having 2 stones. One represents Jesus and the other the Holy Spirit. It is knowing Him, not knowing about Him.
1st is you in Him, learning His ways.
2nd is when the process becomes Him in you, revealing "YOU TO YOU". (example: layers of self being peeled away) Could it be that God will at times allow depression to show us that not all of our rooms are bright with the Joy of the Lord but that there are still dark rooms within us that He wants healed to let the curtain be torn back to show light in every room of our soul.
God sent His Son to meet with us and His Holy Spirit to dwell within us.
The mystery of this place is that you can be in Him and He in you at the same time.
Hope I didn't get weird - just a revelation I got this morning while studying.
Greg wrote, "Is it a contradiction?" Dang, that's a great question...one that merits further study. For now, though: Is it not possible to fulfill and destroy the law simultaneously? The first thing that comes to mind is a bomb (Like Jesus, phenomenal cosmic powers...itty bitty living space)...okay it's a lame comparison but work with me here. A bomb is intended for one purpose...to explode. In exploding it fulfills it's purpose as well as destroys it. I'm sure I can come upw ith a bette illustration but I'm on my lunch break.. You get the idea, though, right? Is one necessarily exclusive of the other? Hmmmmmmm.
Okay, you guys are blazing at break neck speeds through this while I'm happily entrenched in the depths of the sea...so to speak. In 2:2 is some really cool stuff. Like all of the letters that comprise what we call the new testament this one was written, not to an individual but to a community...a community...and is to be read as such. I think Paul is giving us some remarkable insight into how this community is to function in these verses. Here's what I read:
You want to know Christ? Not just know about but truly know, intimately, this mysterious God? Well, in order for that to happen you have to live in an environment of encouragement, and unity in love, then you can have the full riches of complete understanding. This is what leads to knowing Him, in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. A friend of mine says that God set it up that way 'cuz He likes it when we play nice together. I think he's right.
to know Him and make Him known...
Not weird at all Revonda...real good stuff! Our life is to be a constant drawing closer to God (and/or dying to self). I never really thought about the old testament tabernacle as being a symbol of our relationship with God (having different stages and levels). But it makes sense and it makes us realize there is always another "room" that we can enter that brings us even closer to God, another step in our sanctification.
"Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day." (Col. 2:16)
I love this verse! If you've ever been looked down on because of your lack of conformity to religion then you too should love this verse. Do you not wear a suit and tie to church? Do you not show up every Sunday morning?...every Sunday night?...every Wednesday night? Do you not witness door to door? Do you eat meat sacrificed to idols?...Well, let's scratch that last one.
But what Paul rights about these man made rules is pretty interesting. Check out verse 23:
"Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom...but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence"
They lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence! I read that to mean that they don't help stop a heart from sinning. Going to church every time the doors are open doesn't mean I have a love for God and people. I could have this love and go to church, but going to church won't give me this love. No rule or regulation will give me this love. This is a love that comes from Christ and only Christ. And when we point others toward church, proper dress codes, decent morals, abstaining from certain foods or drinks (or cigarettes),or even sexual preferences, and we do it without pointing toward Christ first, then we are wasting their time. No amount of discipline saves a person from their sins or saves their evil heart from condemnation. Only Jesus Christ save us from that!
So the only thing of value I have to offer this fallen world full of sin and hate is a finger pointing toward Jesus, a mouth proclaiming the love of Jesus, and a heart in pursuit of Jesus.
"May the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be pleasing in your sight, O LORD, my Rock and my Redeemer" (Psalms 19:14)
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